Apprenticeship PDSAT Employment Status Exceptions

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This topic contains 4 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  DonT 1 month, 1 week ago.

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  • DonT
    Participant

    Good afternoon

    We are getting these Apprenticeship PDSAT Employment Status Exceptions below, where instead of the ‘Date employment status applies’, applying to the start date of the Apprenticeship Programme when learners are employed, its looking at the day before when learners employment status’ are not employed, hence the exception. These exceptions are going through the ILR as warnings. (See example below):

    W EmpStat_12 The Employment status on the start date of an apprenticeship programme should be employed ZPROG001 35 ERADVBUSAD

    We had a similar problem last year with a new apprentice whose employment status the day before starting their programme was employed. This created an ILR error because there was no EDS number linked to this employment, which there wouldn’t be as it was work the learner did prior to starting their apprenticeship programme. At the time I raised a call with SFA and basically got nowhere, so had to find my own work around as the learner had missed going through two ILR Returns.

    In the ILR Specification the ‘Date employment status applies’ states:
    “The date of one of the Employment Status records must be before the start date of the earliest recorded learning aim or programme aim.”

    The dilemma is that the apprenticeship programmes are rolling courses over several years, so the earliest recorded learning aim may have been on the system from the previous year.

    Has anyone else had this issue? And did you find a resolution?

     
    #143387

    Mark
    Participant

    Two scenarios are not working and become employed by starting an apprenticeship and already employed.
    for the first one we have two records, the date before the start date they are u/e and there is no edrs and for the second record the date matches the start date and there is an edrs.
    for second scenario there is only one record before the start date with an edrs.

    Does that make sense?

     
    #143389

    DonT
    Participant

    Hi Mark,
    Thanks for your response. Our apprentices start with the employer (ours are mostly council employed too), on the first day of their programme, hence the employment status as employed, which is in line with the Provider Manual and examples below:

    12.1.1 Recording employment status for apprenticeships
    455. For all apprentices, you must return an employment status record of the apprentice’s employment status prior to the start of the programme.
    456. A new employment status record with a Date employment status applies of the first day of the apprenticeship programme must be added under the following circumstances:
    • The apprentice was unemployed prior to starting the programme, or
    • The apprentice was employed with a different employer prior to starting their programme.
    457. All apprentices must have an employment status record that applies on the first day of their programme with an employment status of ‘In paid employment’ (Employment status code 10) and Employment intensity of 16 hours or more (ESMType = EII and ESMCode <> 2), except where the alternative completion conditions apply for an apprenticeship framework. Refer to the Apprenticeships: common funding rules for full details.

    Examples
    1. Apprentice who is unemployed prior to starting the programme
    A learner starts an apprenticeship programme on 15 September 2016 with ABC engineering. The learner was unemployed and looking for work prior to starting the apprenticeship.
    • An Employment status record with a date prior to 15 September 2016 is recorded with a status of “Not in paid employment and looking for work and available to start work” (code 11).
    • A second Employment status record with a date of 15 September 2016 is recorded with a status of “in paid employment” (code 10). The Employer identifier for ABC engineering is recorded.

    2. Apprentice who is employed with a different employer prior to starting the programme
    A learner starts an apprenticeship programme on 28 September 2016 with ABC engineering. The learner was employed in the week prior to starting the apprenticeship with a different employer.
    • An Employment status record with a date prior to 28 September 2016 is recorded with a status of “in paid employment” (code 10). No Employer identifier needs to be recorded.

    Provider Support Manual 2016 to 2017 Version 3 – December 2016 Page 68 of 126

    But even though we follow the guidance given above, it still creates errors/warnings & pdsat exceptions, so was wondering if anyone else had a similar issue. As mentioned earlier, we took this to SFA and they confirmed that we were recording the employment status’s correctly. 

     
    #143391

    Mark
    Participant

    If they were not employed before the apprenticeship you have two records. One dated before the start to show unemployed and no employer and another with the same date as the start showing as employed with the EDRS for that employer.
    If they are already employed before starting the apprenticeship there is one record only that shows they were employed before the start that includes the employer information which is dated before the start date of the apprenticeship.
    This is what we are doing and we don’t get any errors or warnings.
    The only times we have had errors is when someone has included the employer information against the unemployed record by mistake.

     
    #143593

    DonT
    Participant

    Thanks Mark. Much appreciated.

     
    #143724
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