Tagged: Return after break in learning
Not sure if this has been covered before, but we have just had an interesting if somewhat frustrating conversation with the ‘helpline’.
We have a learner who has returned from sick and we have looked at the guidance documentation regarding ILR which appears to be straight forward as almost the same as previous to the Levy.
In so far as the Apprenticeship Service Levy account is concerned, there is no guidance available and the advice is to call them each time if you need assistance!
For information, we have been told that we need to create a new record for the learner on the Apprenticeship Service account using the new start and PED, but reduce the funding value down by the value that has been paid so far for the learner on the original record.
If anyone has any further information it would be appreciated
ThanksOctober 12, 2018 at 11:48 am #295783
The helpline are incorrect again, see the guidance from the ILR Provider Support Manual for what you should do when a learner returns from a BIL:
645. When the apprentice returns, a new programme aim and new component learning aim(s) are recorded as in Table 10 below. The original learning aims on the ILR must not be reopened.
646. Record the price details as required using AFinType = TNP and the applicable codes. The price recorded on the new programme aim should be the same as the price prior to the break in learning unless you and the employer have negotiated a new price for the programme.
647. You must continue to return all aims and financial records for the apprenticeship, including the records prior to the break in learning, until the apprenticeship is completed or the apprentice withdraws from the programme.
It is only for Maths and English aims you need to have a funding adjustment where they are a restart.
HTHOctober 12, 2018 at 12:29 pm #295815
I have been advised that that only applies to the ILR return NOT the record on the Apprenticeship Service which is managed in a completely different way.
It is a bit ridiculous as you need to speak to one set of people for ILRs and another for the Apprenticeship Service and they do not talk to each other!
Confusion reigns….October 12, 2018 at 1:57 pm #295860
It is a bit of an issue to know what to do, it is simple for the ILR as there is comprehensive guidance but the same is not true for the Apprenticeship service DAS accounts as there is no documented guidance.
I would have assumed that in the DAS account you would only lift the pause and it would continue to use the existing record which would then match with the return from BIL record in the ILR.
We only know what we don’t know.October 12, 2018 at 2:40 pm #295882
Agreed – the ILR space is straight forward.
You would think that the pause was for the breaks in learning wouldn’t you, as this would make logical sense….and this exactly what we thought it was for BUT we have been advised that this is NOT to be used for breaks in learning, as this facility is only to pause payments to providers if there is an issue with the delivery of the programme.
For breaks in learning, you have to completely stop the learner in the DAS and then recreate another record when they return – hence the amendment to the value.
Clear as mud….October 12, 2018 at 2:52 pm #295889
As they have no documentation for DAS it could be they just make it up as they go along as it is not the way I see the accounts working. All that are on pause on DAS relate to learners on a BIL the employer did not put them on pause the ILR did when it reported the BIL.
I can see that the advice could apply where the employer put a stop on the account but not for a pause as in my experience when the restart is included in the ILR that is all that was required.
As you say clear as mud.October 12, 2018 at 3:07 pm #295901
I would be interested to know the outcome of this.
When you reduced the price on the new DAS record did this not create a matching error?
I’m really trying to get my head around it, but struggling.
ThanksFebruary 20, 2019 at 9:44 am #347130
I think you have been told incorrectly.
Pause = breaks in learning
Stopped = apprentice left employer or issue with the delivery of the programme
If DAS has a status of stopped you have to in effect get the employer to reverse the stopped status and then add the cohort on again from the original start.
See more info here:
For Breaks in learning, employers aren’t required to make any amendments to DAS, the ILR will stop payments and then levy payments will start being paid again as soon as record them on your MI system as restarting.
However our experience has been that employers like to think they have control over their levy payments and will use ‘stopped incorrectly and when they don’t need to.February 20, 2019 at 2:11 pm #347291
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