Funding internal apprentices

[LucyNGTCParticipant]

Hi,

We are doing some internal training through our direct contract. We are enrolling our staff onto standards and just wondering what funding we will receive. Can we claim the full amount of funding based on the funding bands or is there a rule in place that suggests we can’t make a profit on our own staff training and therefore can only claim funding to cover our costs?

Thanks,
Lucy

• This topic was modified 7 months, 2 weeks ago by  LucyNGTC.

[Martin WestParticipant]

Hi Lucy,
All I can find on this is in EP rules:
136.2.must evidence how all costs are calculated (this is for transparency and to ensure value for money – in the case of a main provider and a separate employer there is a negotiation of costs; this cannot be achieved when the employer and provider are the same entity)

I would assume the same would apply for any provider but I can only find it in the EP rules.
HTH

[JJP1981Participant]

Hi Martin,

Sorry to jump in on this thread. So as a provider (not EP), you can deliver apprenticeships to your staff as long as you can demonstrate value for money? Does this differ depending on the contract type? e.g. it’s okay for AEB or for levy paying providers too?

thanks,
JJ.

[Martin WestParticipant]

Where you deliver an Apprenticeship to your own staff as you cannot negotiate a training price with yourself and can only use actual evidenced costs for training plus EPA costs if it is a standard.
For AEB all learners follow the same eligibility criteria for fundingat the listed rates as normal.
HTH

[JJP1981Participant]

Thank you Martin

[LucyNGTCParticipant]

Thank you both

[Martin WestParticipant]

Hi Lucy,
Version 6 of the funding rules clarifies this in P1 with the addition of ‘Training providers delivering to their own staff should follow the employer-provider rules and only claim actual costs’
HTH

[LucyNGTCParticipant]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for this, do you have any idea where we could find some guidance on how we work out the actual costs for delivery?

Thanks,

Lucy

[GaynorLFParticipant]

Hi all

I would be very interested to see what people are including in their delivery costs if anyone is willing to offer any guidance. Obviously I don’t expect to see £ amounts being charged but any information/lists regarding actual apprenticeship costs being claimed for would be extremely welcome.
Thanks
Gaynor

[Martin WestParticipant]

Hi,
The following from the ER rules outlines what can be included as direct costs.

EP72. Funds from your digital account, government-employer co-investment or the additional transitional funds paid for 16-18 year olds on frameworks must only be used for activity directly related to the apprenticeship. These funds must only be used to pay for training and assessment, including end-point assessment, to attain an apprenticeship that is eligible for funding up to the limit of the funding band. This includes the following.

72.1. Off-the-job training through an externally-contracted provider or evidenced costs for employer-provider delivery. This could include some or all of the training aspects of a licence to practise or non-mandatory qualification. In both cases there must be a clear overlap between this training and the knowledge, skills and behaviors needed for the apprenticeship standard.

72.2. Registration and examination (including certification) costs associated with mandatory qualifications excluding any licence to practise (see paragraph 75.7).

72.3. Planned on-programme assessment (progress reviews) and the formal end-point assessment including any costs associated with the completion certification for the apprenticeship.

72.4. Distance, online or blended learning relating to the off-the-job training element of an apprenticeship.

72.5. Materials (non-capital items) used in the delivery of the apprenticeship framework or standard. By materials (non-capital items) we mean the equipment or supplies necessary to enable a particular learning activity to happen. These items would not normally have a lifespan beyond the individual apprenticeship being funded.

72.6. Any administration directly linked to the training and assessment, including end-point assessment. This includes costs relating to the development of teaching materials, lesson planning, the processing of the ILR and quality assurance.

72.7. Funding to retake mandatory qualifications or the end-point assessment, providing additional learning takes place.

72.8. Accommodation costs for learning delivered through residential modules where the residential learning is a requirement for all apprentices. Any costs for residential modules must represent value for money.

72.9. Costs of an apprentice taking part in a skills competition if you have evidence that participation in the competition directly contributes to helping that individual achieve the apprenticeship standard.

HTH

[LucyNGTCParticipant]

Thanks Martin, its a little clearer now but we are still ensure as to how we can evidence all this and work all the costs out. Have you worked this out before in the past for any standards you are running?

[GaynorLFParticipant]

Thanks Martin

i already have all this from the funding rules. i was hoping to see some examples of 72.4, 72.5 and 72.6 that providers are listing.

thanks anyway.

[Martin WestParticipant]

You could do something like this on a spreadsheet:

Estimated Eligible Costs (per cohort)
Training to achieve the apprenticeship including qualifications – Estimate for (f) learners per annum – 0
Registration, assessment, materials and examination – Estimate for (f) learners per annum – 0
Administration – Staff and Sundry costs per annum – 200,000
Accommodation for residential trips – related to the delivery of the apprenticeships – 0
Costs for use of premises – where the residential learning is a requirement – 0
Wages and associated costs – Staff costs for Trainer/Assessors – 500,000
(a) Total costs per annum – 700,000
(b) Duration of the programme in years – 1.5
(c) Total estimated cost of training (a)*(b) – 1,050,000
(d) End point assessment – 1,000,000 made up of (f) * 1,000
(e) Total estimate of the cost of the cohort (c)+(d) – 2,050,000
(f) Number of learners – 1,000
(g) Estimated actual cost per apprentice (e)/(f) – 2,050
(h) Funding band maximum – 5,000
(i) Difference from funding band(h-g) – -2,950

In this example the estimated actual cost per individual of the cohort is £2050 and the funding band maximum is £5000. As the estimated actual cost per individual is within the funding band and within the amount of Levy available, this can be funded from the Levy. Co-funding does not apply in this example and no additional costs are payable by the employer.

[GaynorLFParticipant]

thanks Martin.

That’s a great help.